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Post by jimnelson on Sept 18, 2013 20:05:48 GMT -8
I suggest we consider including something about Rockfall in the curriculum. Climber Caused Rockfall in particular. I know I would feel terrible if I dislodged a rock that injured another climber, but I also believe that often it is beyond my control to not dislodge rocks. We need to have strategies and awareness of climber caused rockfall, and it might be good to have it included in our courses.
For myself I have adopted the strategy to expect rockfall from parties above, and will often choose not to climb a route (or section of route) if there is another party above. I am taking responsibility for my own safety as much as possible, knowing that it is not always possible to not dislodge rocks.
Recognizing these danger areas requires a fair bit of experience. Being aware of “safe” areas and “exposed” areas, good communication also come to mind. Party size could be a part of the discussion as well. What else?
Freedom currently has only a few sentences about Rockfall, and pretty much buried in the text. I would like to see Rockfall and also Climber Caused Rockfall both have their own paragraph or section.
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Post by gregggagliardi on Sept 19, 2013 10:32:45 GMT -8
I wholeheartedly agree. 4.5% of the accidents in the Boulder Study (see below) were caused by rockfall. 8.5% of the fatalities were caused by rockfall. www.rockymountainrescue.org/publications/2012_WEMJ_RMRG_Rock_Climb_Accidents.pdfRock fall is one of those objective hazards (like avalanches) over which we have no control except by complete avoidance. Rock fall is to rock climbing as avalanche is to snow/glacier climbing. We have lots of information about how to assess and avoid avalanches, but almost nothing about how to assess and avoid rock fall hazard. Who among us has not had a near miss?
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Post by dougsanders on Sept 21, 2013 16:16:05 GMT -8
As rockfall played a significant role in the worst accident in The Mountaineers' history, the Sharkfin Tower tragedy, perhaps there is a way to incorporate the climb into F9. Seems to me we might be able to pay tribute to the climbers by using the accident to illustrate a number of points related to hazards, safety, and rescue, including rockfall.
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Post by jimnelson on Oct 4, 2013 9:23:20 GMT -8
Gregg,
I am suggesting we separate Rockfall and Climbing Caused Rockfall. I see them as different enough, and with different strategies. I think it could help to improve awareness of Climbing Caused Rockfall, which seems low in the overall climbing community.
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Post by gregggagliardi on Oct 7, 2013 10:49:28 GMT -8
Jim: I agree. These are two different kinds of problems with different recommendations for prevention and management.
There is a kind knack one develops when climbing loose scree, talus and rock. Consideration should be given to including presenting risk assessment strategies for these situations along with techniques to manage risk. Better yet would be adding controlled practice on terrain of this type for scrambles and basic climbing students.
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Post by mattpalubinskas on Oct 11, 2013 13:24:38 GMT -8
I will introduce the concept that Jim mentions (climber causes rockfall) into my Basic Rock lecture. Also, please note that I am attempting to make the Basic lectures more participatory (regarding the students engagement). Perhaps this is a good topic for small break-out sessions or discussions. Discussions may vary depending on level of experience.
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