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Post by mod-gregg on Apr 9, 2013 10:22:02 GMT -8
Most climbers, especially novices and weekend warriors don't do much expeditionary climbing. Also there are a number of books exclusively devoted to planning expeditions. How much space in Freedom 9 should be devoted to expeditions?
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Post by nicklyle on Apr 12, 2013 6:11:47 GMT -8
I believe a modest chapter outlining the parameters of expedition planning remains a useful part of the book. Expeditions are part of the alpine experience, and a surprising number of people involve themselves in outings that have many elements of the full scale expedition. Think of Denali.
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Post by gregggagliardi on Apr 18, 2013 12:24:46 GMT -8
What do folks think about asking an experienced expedition planner (like Joe Horiskey from RMI or Eric Simonson from IMG) to write the chapter and include as an exhibit (in supplementary electronic form) an actual expedition plan and trip report for Denali or another common destination?
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Post by ebellataschoenleitner on Apr 23, 2013 3:23:46 GMT -8
The one thing I'd like to see in that chapter is the distinction between expedition climbing and alpine style climbing for long periods. pros/cons; equipment.... or a sub-section for alpine high altitude climbing.
Eva
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Post by dougsanders on Aug 24, 2013 10:39:10 GMT -8
A great many of the posted climbs are 1-2 days and oriented toward meeting graduation requirements. I am disappointed by the number of Basic and Intermediate climbers who have never been out for more than a 2 day trip. Is there benefit in focusing on 7+/- day adventures such as the Pickets, Chilliwacks or Ptarmigan Traverse; lengthy scrambles such as into the Pasayten; or even, longer backpacking trips?
A sense of a what a Denali climb entails, a common NW climber aspiration, is worthwhile. The Mexican volcanoes and trekking have some merit, too.
There really isn't enough space to address international expeditions except as an introduction perhaps giving the climber an idea as to the requisite experience one and how to get started climbing outside North America.
Is there too much detail in F8 on sleds and fixed lines compared to the other content?
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Post by jimnelson on Aug 27, 2013 10:03:59 GMT -8
How do we define expedition? Doug describes a self-supported wilderness type of expedition that might have a place.
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Post by gregggagliardi on Aug 27, 2013 15:29:37 GMT -8
My recommendation would be for a chapter that introduces expeditionary climbing and provides good references to other information, books, guides and other sources on the details of expeditionary planning.
As an example I am considering an expedition to climb in the Cordillera Blanca (Peru). In preparation for this I am not reading Freedom of the Hills, I am reading Brad Johnson's "Classic Climbs of the Cordillera Blanca". It includes the important logistic details for climbing in the Cordillera Blanca, details that would go way beyond what is appropriate for a chapter in Freedom of the Hills. This is the sort of beta that one needs.
A key decision with any expedition is whether to hire a guide. I am finding that this is lot more complicated than I expected. The decision doesn't turn so much on technical support as it does on very practical matters like who to hire as porters, cooks, etc. Guides who specialize in a certain area have mastered this practical stuff as well as knowledge of weather patterns and route conditions and a whole assortment of make-or-break travel info, lodging, government permits and regulations, etc.
It seems to me that the technical differences between an expedition and a long, multi-day climb are relatively few and could be covered in a short chapter. It is the logistic differences that stand out, and these details tend to vary a lot from one expedition to the next. So much so that no single book could do an adequate job. What might be especially valuable for such a chapter would be checklist or decision tree that covers the major issues; i.e., am I ready to take on a climb of this technical difficulty or not; guide or no guide; rescue insurance or not; hire an experienced local to provide logistic support or do it yourself; who join a guide selected team or select your own climbing team and hire a guide.
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Post by nicklyle on Jan 26, 2015 14:16:32 GMT -8
There has been a suggestion that rather than trying to encompass the vast topic of expeditions on all scales this chapter might be more useful if it covered the topic of practical nuts and bolts considerations for longer multi-day unsupprted alpine climbing trips, the kind of trips where food weighs more than gear and where communication with rescue may not be an option.
This book is not just for Mountaineers! There are many oportunities for this sort of longer climbing trip in the NW, particularly as you head North into Canada. The nuts and bolts apply to any extended self-sufficient alpine style climb, anywhere in the world, without needing to get into the elaborate logistics of getting to the route in far flung corners of the globe.
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